This is Waste to Wealth, a podcast about turning your waste hauling business into a profitable, scalable cash flowing machine. And now, here's your host, Michael Welcome to Waste to Wealth. Dean, I'm so excited that you're joining me today to talk about how you help people with their sales. We primarily help waste haulers with their business. Buffalo Finances is our accounting firm. We help a lot of people, but the primary people that we help are waste haulers like junk removal guys, dumpster rental, trash, trash, collectors. And they have to, everyone's got to sell, they have to sell as well. I'm sure that you probably have some things that they'd have to do. But why don't you tell me about you and your company and how you help people solve Yeah, so Michael, thanks so much. I appreciate you having me on your podcast. So at Engage, we help companies create amazing content for their sales teams. We help them share it to make sure everyone has all the latest stuff when they need it, where they need it. And then we give them tools to measure how that content is impacting the sales. So let's say you have a sales presentation that you are using with your sales team. We make sure if they have it on their iPad, the latest version is always there, which is a huge thing when you don't even think about it. But, you know, is it version 7.7 on the shared drive or no, everybody has what they need. And then most importantly, if you've trained them in a particular way on how to actually use that content, we can get we give the sales leadership the ability to view analytics, to understand how people are actually using that content when they're face to face Oh, that makes a lot of sense. So that way, when you are talking to a customer, you're not just winging it, right? You actually have a plan, you have a presentation ready to go. That's right. Sell That's right. And what we find, the most successful customers that we have do a great deal of training on sales process. And then that sales process is baked in to the sales content that they provide to the sales team. When the sales team has really great on-brand and it's very interactive, so it's not your normal presentation. It's very interactive content. Interactive sliders to show before and after. Embedded videos that play without delay. No streaming buffering problems. All of the content is there. What that does is it gives the sales rep confidence. A competent sales rep will close at a much higher rate because the materials they have support them in the journey that they're taking the customer on to educate them. Because I believe sales is a process of education, not of selling. And the better you can educate someone, the more likely they are to see you as the solution to the problem they have, not the piece of software or the technology that you need to buy. You're the solve for Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah, because no one wants to get sold to we want to, we really want to be informed and make it, you know, a good decision. Not because we got convinced, but because That's right. I think the convincing is that you're basically convinced that the pain that you have can be solved by the solution that someone's saying, whether that's junk removal or software or home improvement, it doesn't matter. That whole idea of selling is no one wants, like you said, I think you said it really well, no one wants to be sold to, they Right. And they want to buy. I think Americans love to buy stuff. We can try our solutions. We're happy to do that. That's great, Dean. How did you get involved in this? Like what prompted you to start this business and Did you, has Yeah. So this business it's, it's a long story. I'll keep the long story to a condensed version. So the business that we have, the company's been around since 2008 and we were one of the first companies to do interactive touch experiences on touch devices. So if you think back to 2008, what was the only touch device that was really in the market? It was the iPhone. So we were the first app to do books on the iPhone. So if you had a book on your iPhone back in 2008 from the App Store, we probably made it. Because what we had come up with was this interesting page turn technology to make the books interactive. Very simple. From that, we built core competency around these interactive experiences, and the company evolved into a digital agency. They were doing very high-end work, million-dollar apps for Fortune 500 companies. At the time, I worked at Apple. and we were part of a group that was bringing iPhone and iPad to business. We were building a partner program, so we recruited Engage to be part of our partner program. We convinced them to build a piece of software for the iPad that would take all of the things that they were doing in building these custom enterprise experiences into an app that Michael and Dean and anybody else who had a basic understanding of building a presentation could use those same interactive experience, could build those same interactive experiences. Fast forward to today. I joined the company nine years ago. It took us about four years to really understand that vision and get the product ready. For the past five years, we've been selling the Engage solution to the market as this create, share, measure, tool Got it. So it sounds like you got into it after they had gotten started and the company is really, they have the goal of helping people with their sales and the tool is the That's right. The business was actually helping people achieve the same result, but it was a very different delivery mechanism. The delivery was a very, it was software that the company had created, but it required a lot of work on top of it. Creative design, coding, and this product that we've built is no code. We help you with the design. Like we try to take all of the heavy lifting out. in order to put the power in the platform so that you can leverage it to build amazing interactive experiences for your sales teams Yeah. And you also mentioned measuring. And as a numbers guy, I think measuring is really important. Otherwise, you don't even know if you're making progress. You're just hoping you are. So what kind of things do you have to measure in your company or for Yeah, so I think there's several different things. So sales leaders want to know that the things that they're investing in on the back end are actually helping at the point of sale. So how do you inform sales and marketing leadership that the content that you enabled the sales team with is actually converting at the kitchen table? In our world, we serve the home improvement space primarily as our primary market. they want to know without having to do a four-legged sales call, without having to do the ride-along, are my team members following the script that we've taught them on? We give them a tool that they can visually see that when Michael went out to Dean's house, he actually spent two minutes in this section and two minutes in that section and five minutes here and one minute there to see if they're following the script. We also give them the ability to compare different people. Let's say you have five sales team members. You can compare the sessions that they're doing. You can also look at it in aggregate. If you know you ran 50 appointments last week on your sales team, but you only see 35 presentation sessions, what happened to the other 15? Are we having tech issues where the iPads just aren't working and people haven't let you know? Are people not buying into the whole platform of what you're doing and how they believe it can help? What I love is because all those are kind of the big brother effect. Oh, they're watching me. I actually like the other side. Let's say you are enabled with the platform and you go out and you're selling at a 10% higher close rate than anyone else on the team. But when the sales leadership looks at how you're using your content, they see that it's not exactly how it was taught, but they now see that you're closing at a higher rate. Well, now maybe you can give feedback to the team of how everyone could be better using that Yeah, and maybe upgrade the content so everyone's gonna get higher That's another great example. Let's say they go through and they look and page seven, everybody skips over. It's two seconds time on page seven. Are people just not giving you feedback that there's a typo or that the video no longer works or whatever is happening on that page? It gives you a sense of how should I be updating the presentations and have that content to be ready to go Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I love the idea of doing presentations to educate people and then having an opportunity for people to buy at the end of that presentation. So that works for my industry. I think on the waste hauling industry, they have to deal with people that are more contractors. They're normally the target market of waste haulers. And a contractor that's educated about how useful it is to have a dumpster rental company that's responsive is really helpful for everybody. But if you've got There's contractors that think, hey, I can hire my own guys, get my own equipment, and they're actually losing out on revenue. So if a waste hauler can convince them or create content and educate them that partnering with them is going to save the contractor money, then they're going to have a great relationship Do you work with people that have smaller transactions that don't require a big sales cycle, or maybe that Like in the case I just gave you, the contractors that hire dumpster rental companies, they've got, it's many, many orders. Like it's not just one order and then they have relationships. Hey, I'm starting a new project, now I have to make an order. Do you work with clients We do. I mean, we deal with all different business sizes. Our bread and butter is the person who has the longer sales cycle, they're going to come in your house, they're going to explain what a new roof is and the roofing system and the different layers and the colors and the They're in your home for a while. We also have a lot of companies where the tech is the salesperson. Think of garage door replacement or concrete coatings or HVAC or something like that. The content is very different. but they still use content to convert at whatever the point of sale is. The point of sale might be virtual meetings. The point of sale might be a face-to-face conversation. The content might be on an iPad or a computer, but it could also be on a phone. So it really depends on the use case. And we work hand in glove during our onboarding process with our customers to really identify the best way to design content. And I say design intentionally. You can't just create stuff. You have to intentionally design it to fit the process that is most appropriate to convert Kind of work backwards. Like who are you trying to market to? Is it a homeowner? Is it a business owner? Like those are different avatars, That's right. That's right. We have B2B, B2C. You're still selling something. You're still educating on a process. What we find also is most sales processes are not linear. Meaning you don't start at A and go to Z and hit every letter in between. You go from A to F and back to E and then up to Q and then back to W. You're just all over the place because the way people think and how you can drive them to a result, it has to be different. We're all different. That's another feature of what we do is being able to very easily navigate throughout the content that you have with different controls that we have technically in the platform. But to me, that's also a critical piece of any sales software you're deploying. Can it meet the needs of the sales rep in the face of the heat of the battle? Can they move where they need to move to talk about the thing or to show the Yeah, it's hard unless you've had a lot of practice to react on your feet. Like when an obstacle comes up or someone's like, oh, I'm not interested to say the right thing to prompt the conversation to keep moving forward. So yeah, is that something that you got, how do you guys adapt to that challenge? That Yeah, I like to think of it, there's, and maybe I'm splitting hairs on words, but I like that a sales rep has the ability to respond rather than to react. So a reaction comes as like a, it's a reaction, it's a gut, it's a twitch versus response, which is intentional. And what we like to do is, the best sales processes out there are very intentional on how to handle objections, the path you should probably take someone down. We talk in this order about these things and we know that that converts. but you have to be able to respond in the moment when all of a sudden you get punched in the face with a question you're not 100% expecting. We're very biased in this approach, but having great content gives that sales rep the confidence to go back to a place, a known place to present something that will help that customer understand maybe a complex topic or combat the objection that they have. Those Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I could see, like, if you have a salesman that is selling contracts, this is common. They're trying to sell long-term contracts for front load cans, for commercial waste. Those contracts are normally like one to three years, and then you want them to renew. And you have sales guys that go business to business to try to get those contracts. And most of the time, business owners are going to ask about the price, and they're just going to focus on the price. And you have to convince them that price is not everything, even when it's talking about waste removal. You got to have, you have to have consistent service. You want texts that aren't going to damage things because that happens. And if there is a problem, how are they going to hold up the company? It gets sucks to get ahold of a giant waste management company, like publicly traded companies. They have, they have people in India answering the phone. They don't know where you are, but if you have a look, you know, if you have a local presence, you're going to be able to help those business owners. And so you put that in a presentation that they Well, the reality is they need to tell the right story. And when I think the best sellers are the best storytellers. So if you want to bring someone along a journey to help them understand how you solve their problem, if you just give them feature after feature after feature, they're going to close down. But if you tell them a story about how you solve the customer success nightmare that they had when the thing wasn't going right at the site and the the story is going to sell. Well, how do you support that with great visuals or a video or a testimonial? That kind of content is super, super important in Right. Oh, I can totally see it now. We had a circumstance where maybe this would go into one of the presentations. We had a local person call us. I used to run a dumpster rental business, so this is actually me. We had a local person, everyone's local, call us and say, hey, the guy that I hired, the contractor that I hired isn't getting back to me. They don't even know where my street is because their receptionist is in a different state. She's like in Ohio or something like that. We're in North Carolina. And they called us up and we were able to help them out in just like three hours. Like we were there the same day. And who knows how long it would have taken a publicly traded company to solve that problem. And so that story gets the result and it's memorable, right? Oh, you helped out in an emergency because you're local, you know where the streets are, you're actually a human being in town, you're not far, Imagine the sales process, right? And you get asked that question and the sales rep would say, oh, I remember one time this woman called us and it was an emergency and we responded in three hours. What's more powerful? The sales rep relaying secondhand the information that they said or having the ability to very easily navigate to the sales materials that you have, push play, no lag, and the person's video comes up and says, So it's a different sales motion. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, we have a I have a great customer success story. Do you mind if I show that to you? Oh, yeah. Well, no. Would you tell me secondhand so I don't trust you? No. They hear it right from the horse's mouth because you have access to that kind of stuff right Oh, so do you actually get customers to record their their success? So powerful. But Yeah. I mean, one of the things that a lot of people put, I mean, you want social proof of how you solve problems for people. It's not, it's such a, anyone who's not using social proof to help them in their sales process is missing a huge opportunity at, you know, for conversion. So why not have 10, 15 customer testimonials that answer the most common objections in your sales process and have them queued up so that the sales rep can show them live in the, in the conversation with easy access to those. Way more convincing than telling this. I mean, the story's great, but having a real testimonial pop up, that's the Well, that makes a lot of sense. We like social verification that something's real and to hear the result come from someone else that's like us. So I gather that social I'll tell you, a lot of people think it's challenging, but I think it's a lot easier than you think. I think the person who's not comfortable creating content is gonna say, well, I need to get a video person, I need to schedule all these things. Take out your cell phone when you're talking to them and have them talk to it. These things don't have to be the most polished, perfect, perfect lighting, perfect setting, perfect, no. The more I believe, this is my opinion, the more raw and authentic it is, the more it's going to resonate with the person that you're talking to. Don't overthink it. Just capture them. You never know when those types of things are going to prove extremely valuable for you in your sales process or when you're creating content for your sales team. There's Yeah, I definitely believe that because that's what Who else? I mean, look, everybody has Google reviews or whatever those, you know, that they go and if I go and buy something on Amazon, I look at the reviews. If it's a decent, I mean, if it's a $10 purchase, I'm usually not looking at the reviews, but if I'm spending a significant amount on something, I'm gonna go look and see what the reviews are. What are people saying? Well, why wouldn't you do that for your product as well? No matter what it is, even if it's a junk hauling dumpster thing. I mean, there's people who have had great experiences with you, share those with your next best Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And it goes along with your brand, right? Your brand is very valuable. Social proof I mean, there's a reason you're doing a podcast. There's a reason I'm coming on podcasts. We believe that we help people solve problems. We need to tell those stories to go back to the original you know, conversation around, well, what is the value? It's storytelling. How do you, what are all the means by which you can tell those stories? You can tell them in words, you can tell them in videos, you can communicate them orally. There's lots of different ways, but those stories sell. The I love it. So do you have some more stories you could tell us about some customer successes? I mean, I guess it's secondhand, but I still would love I don't have a presentation ready to bring them up. My worst, the cobbler's children have no shoes on this one. We have lots of different ways that we help people. The way I like to think about it is, can we help you be more effective at whatever that number one metric is in your business? Is it closing more sales? Is it converting more leads? Closing sales, converting leads, similar but different, right? In the world today, especially in the market we sell into, which is home improvement, home services, the lead flow has come down since the COVID boom. Like in the COVID boom, these companies had leads on leads on leads, and they could literally not call half of them and still grow their company 100% a year. It was crazy. Well, now lead conversion is the number one thing. So we have a number of customers, and this is part of our sales process is helping you understand that If we can help you raise your close rate by 1%, 2%, 5%, 10%, and we've had people upwards of 20% increase in close rate, what does that mean materially to the sell-through of your business? If you increase it 2%, that's compounds, right? Absolutely. If you're a $1 million, easy math, you're a $1 million a year company, right? Let's do 10 million, it's easier math. $10 million a year company, and we increase your close rate by 10%. So that 10 can be 11 very, very easily. We can add a million dollars in accretive value to your business. Or if we can increase your average ticket. So you don't have to sell more, you just have to sell more to the same people. Or if we can reduce the amount of time that someone's spending in the home, because we can make their sales process more efficient, and they run one extra appointment a day, and you close at a 25% rate, or a 20% rate, which is terrible, but let's say you close at 20% rate, you're closing one more appointment every week, that's how much more in your business, 20% raise. So all of these metrics are, and it depends, every company is a little bit different, what they measure the most. But net sales per lead issued is one that a lot of people will track and we help them improve Yeah. Well, I think in the home services, most people rely on word of mouth, I think. That's just not a reliable way to get more customers. So you rely on word of mouth, you're really shortchanging yourself and you're really just hoping and praying. I like praying, but God wants us to be That's very true. Well, I always say I have a list of words on my wall. And one of the band words in my world is the word hope. Not that I don't believe in hope. I think hope is an amazing thing. But in business, hope is not a strategy. There's a good book on this. I would replace the word hope with the word expect. because we can't hope for things in our business. We need to expect them. And when we expect them, we're going to put strategy and tactics against that, not just prayer. And that to me is in the business world, we have to have a little bit more than hope. We Right. Well, if prayer is just talking to God, I think that it would be talking to God about how we're going to try things and listen to the feedback we get. We're experimenting with what works and what doesn't work. We have a hypothesis. Let's just say, I'm going to call 50 people and try to set up 10 appointments out of that. And I'm going to get feedback about how that goes. So that's right. I would pray before and say, God, give me the courage to follow the script that No, but then you say, I'm going to make 50 calls. My expectation is I will connect on 10 of them. And then if you don't connect on 10 of them, you need to go back and understand why you didn't. And If they're cold calls, it's probably like if you do That's right. I'll go ask our SDRs after I'm here, If they're warm outreaches, they should be higher, but cold is Well, I'm curious about your company's journey and what kind of obstacles you faced that shifted what you did, because you mentioned that you changed the technology that you use to help people. The goal sounds like it's still the same. You want to help people grow. You want to help companies grow. But what caused you to change to your current solution from what you were trying It's all about scalability. We needed to build a more simple solution that allowed our customers to do more of the work and scale on their own. So the previous model was really a design agency model where you told us the requirements and we would build the thing and then we would deliver the thing and you would use it and you would come back and you would say, nope, we want these changes and then we would make those. It was very labor intensive going back and forth. What we have now is a software platform where we wanna teach you to be great and understand how to create in the platform so that you can create an infinite number of things to help your company be successful. So is that pivot from done for you to do it yourself that really changed the game and allowed us to scale? But it also allowed our customers to scale in using the platform to build different types of content to make their business more Oh, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. I found that when I have the opportunity to try something on my own, I'm willing to start sooner than if I have to make a big commitment for someone. And also, they have capacity. When you're an agency, you That's right. And you can only scale through people. You can't scale through systems. The way we have it now, we can scale through systems. We still do a lot. When someone signs onto the platform, we have a very detailed onboarding process. We help them get their first set of content up and running. I don't know about you, but I'm not great with a blank page. If you just put a blank page in front of me, it's almost paralyzing. But what we'll do is we'll come side by side with that customer and we'll help them get over the blank page problem by helping provide templates and samples and coaching on how they can design their content for their sales team. That gets them off and running on the right foot so then they can then build. It is kind of the snowball. We've got to start small. We've got to do something simple. But once it gets rolling down the hill, it'll will feed on itself and people will be enabled to create amazing things in No, that makes sense. So most people, I guess, I guess if they don't work with a professional like yourself, then when they try to create content or create a sales for a slide presentation, they do start with a blank page and they're like, all right, let me imagine all these things, but you probably have templates that have worked for people. And instead of creating from scratch, you tweak it. And then, then you can start trying Iteration is one of your best friends when building content for your sales Yeah. That makes me think of A-B testing. Does Some folks do that. What they'll do is they'll use one version in one market and another in another market, and they'll compare the results. We don't have necessarily an A-B testing feature within the platform, but it's very easy to create a couple of versions and send them to control who gets what, and then measure the results of how one Oh, that makes a lot of sense. Good. Well, what are some of the common pitfalls that you see with your customers and the mistakes that they do over and over again, that when you, when you work with them, you just like remove those problems. Do Yeah, I'll give two. Number one, they, they come to a platform which helps them implement a sales process in content for their team, but they have no sales process. They don't understand it well enough, I should say, in order to put it and embed it in the technology that allows their sales teams to be successful. So it's lack of understanding or clear understanding of their sales process. The second is no clear plan for deploying technology. And I think this is not just in this business. I think this is everywhere. We all read the article or see the thing and we're like, oh, this new technology is going to solve all of our problems in our business. And I think that that planning process of understanding the change management required within a business in order for any piece of technology to be successful is undervalued. and underthought. Those two things, not understanding their sales process well enough and not having a great plan to deploy the technology, I think are the two biggest pitfalls that we see. It has nothing to do with sales. I mean, it's the sales process, yes, but it doesn't have anything to do with anything except being Yeah. So I like both. I want to talk about both of those things because I see the same. Um, and actually I, I struggle with that stuff personally too, but I see it a lot with our clients that, um, the way that customers are adopted is like all over the place. Like it doesn't, it's not, not planned. Um, from what I see with a lot of my clients, they just kind of get them. And if there's not a purposeful way to do it, then you, that goes back to what we talked about with hope. You're just hoping that it works. So you get this process. If you get this presentation for your salespeople, but you don't get, it doesn't fit into a system. Who knows how they're going to use that thing. Right. Is that what you've seen people Well, absolutely. I mean, think about what you're doing. You're saying you, I know you sell this way today, but we're going to introduce this new technology, which it helps you sell a different way. But sales rep is not going to push back against that unless they're like totally not successful. Any successful sales rep is going to say, whoa, timeout, pump the brakes. I don't want any part of this because I'm already successful. I'm making great money. I'm closing at a high rate. You have to help them see where it leads to more money for them. And then they'll get their buy-in. But most people don't think about that. They just don't have a plan. But here's the reality. If it's not connected to the money for the sales team, they're not going to adopt it. It's not connected to outcomes for whatever you know, team that you're rolling a software solution out, if it's not tied to the outcomes that matter to them, it's gonna be very difficult to get their buy-in in the Oh, 100%. And I bet the sales team has ideas that they would love. They're like, well, you know, I'm glad you're trying something, but why don't we try this other thing first? That's right. Step one would be, let's have a process where we're all connected, and then Yeah. Well, I mean, there's a number of, there's so much technology. I mean, we could have a whole conversation around AI and everyone's like, oh, we need AI, we need AI. If the AI solution that you're deploying doesn't actually tie to outcomes that make people more money, that solve real problems, that scratch the itch that they have, what's the point? It needs to tie to the outcomes that Yeah, so I'd love to talk about that. So AI, I think more about automation. That's the step that AI solves because AI is going to do repeatable tasks over and over and over again. But that's not the first step. Although it's sexy, it's sexy to put a robot in charge of something, it's, you can't just put it in charge of something. It's going to, it's going to automate something that doesn't work right. Or maybe it shouldn't even exist. So, um, to steal from Elon Musk, cause he's a smart guy. Um, he has like a five-step process. The first one is to, to make the requirements less dumb, like make the requirements simple. So if the, like a thumbs up on my screen, if the whole point is to make a sale, like, like just how, make it as easy as possible to make a sale. Then you have all these iterations where you make that more efficient. Then after you figure out your whole process, made it efficient, then you automate it. That way, you're automating a successful, efficient process. All this AI craze is not going to work for most people, unfortunately. I would love it Right. Yeah. In our world, we are doing like this much with what we could do with AI. We want to do a lot, but it Yeah, totally. What we've done, so our approach is very simple. We look at the things that we know well, and we're applying AI to those known things. So for example, we know what happens when the phone rings at our company. So we hired an AI answering system than humans, because we know what happens. It's very well understood. If someone calls for me, it goes to this number. If someone calls for Chris, it goes to Chris. If someone calls with a question about sales, it goes to sales. It's a very simple thing, very well-known problem. So we solved that one. What we did is I hired a young man who just graduated college. he was struggling to find employment as a junior coder because AI is really disrupting that initial, that code coder employment base. I said, listen, Let's bring you on board, and you're going to be our AI automation engineer. Number one, it's giving him an opportunity to have employment, but also to build skills around AI so that he can now boost his resume. He's got a job. He's doing really cool stuff that is probably very marketable once he doesn't work here anymore. And what we've done is we've gone internally and tried to look at those processes we understand the most, and he's helping us automate them with AI so that we can get time back for all the team members. So we prioritize the list, he knocks them off one at a time, and that's the approach we're taking. But the problem, to your point, the problem has to be well understood for it to be solved with AI. Right. Yep, exactly. And so in your circumstance, you know exactly what you do. You already have like a Yeah. I think that's a great solution that most people can figure Our call base, so just from a cost basis, right? We're paying one tenth of what we are paying for the other solution that was being Yeah. Have you seen, have you seen Neo yet? It's a new, um, like an Android that you can order for your home. It's a pre-order. That's like a brand new thing. I have not. It's a, I guess OpenAI is one of the companies, OpenAI and Samsung are the two companies I know from the list that are, are doing this. So for 20 grand, you can, you can order one now and That's crazy. There are things that robots can do. I truly believe, though, as much as I think AI is going to solve a lot of problems for people, the tool plus the human is greater than the human. The tool plus the human is also greater than the tool. You need the human still. The question is, what are the high value things that humans should be doing that you no longer have to be doing lower value things because we can have the technology solve those for you? I think it's going to require a lot of people to think through the value that they bring so that they can bring that higher value skill set in order to stay competitive in Right. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. When the computer became mainstream, we all got personal computers. We created more opportunities for production, not less. We didn't, we Same thing here. Uh, well we, we, I got a couple more questions for you. I'm really curious about what you see for the future for how you help people. Do you have like a roadmap for that or a plan for how you continue to Yeah, for sure. Most people when they think about sales content today, it's this thing that the marketing team gives them that they use in the sales process, whatever it is. It used to be the big wall of brochures and you would go in and pull them out and you would go to the meeting and you put a folder in front of someone, right? Now we do all of that electronically. What I see, my vision is that we have not only that, but we also have the ability now for all of that content to be hyper-personalized based on who I'm going to talk to. So if I'm going to you and you live in this neighborhood, I can now personalize that content for the neighborhood that I'm going to, or whatever it is. Think of however your business operates, how could I personalize the things that I'm doing, the message that I'm sending, the emails, the text messages, all of that hyper-personalization to It is. I think it's because I moved so much. Now it's Oh, it's like trying to capture. It doesn't bother me, but I'm sure that it, based on how you were trying to get it right, I'm sure it's frustrating you a little bit, but it'll be fine. It'll be fine. Plus it just started, so it's a new thing. Well, that sounds cool. I think personalization is the best way to use technology going forward. The more you can do that, the more custom, the more you can actually get results. How do people get a hold of you if they want to talk to you about automating their sales and Yeah, I mean, there's a couple of ways. One, I'm very active on Instagram. So DeanCurtis23 on Instagram, if you wanna connect with me personally. And then our company is Engage.io. I think you can see it over my shoulder here, I-N-G-A-G-E.io. And on our website, very low friction in terms of just seeing what we do, how we help customers, how we solve problems for people. And then if it's something that's of interest, just click the link to book a demo. No pressure. Our sales team loves talking to people, understanding their business and how we might be a I wonder if we should pull up your, cause we all, we sit, we, we put the post this video. We can pull up your website. Do you That's right. So we talk about our platform in terms of powerful presentation. And the reason is, if I say to you, if I say to you, presentation, you immediately have something that pops in your head of what a presentation is, right? It's a collection of pages that move in an order. Did my screen Yeah. So the idea being, we wanted to hook people with presentation, but I don't want you to just think it's limited to presentations. It's really about amazing sales content that is available to our customers. And you can create that for any type of device. But That makes sense. So this is a show me, don't just tell me. Like, it's great to tell about results, but you show me, then I'll get the image way faster. This is cool. So this is a restoration picture Yeah. So like I mentioned earlier, the majority of our customers are in the home improvement, home services space. So you'll see a lot of that kind of content on our homepage. You'll notice there that the idea of that interactive before and after, And the thing is, all of this is created with drag and drop interface. You don't need to be a coder. You don't need to have a PhD in design in order to create something that's truly beautiful and intentional in how you design it in order to create those interactive experiences that help you convert through Oh, wow. And this actually works really well for multiple types of So the idea of the sharing, right, we can share it with, so you can control who has access to what. You can also share any content with people outside of your company, whether you want, it's all shared to the web, so they don't have to have a particular app. And we can set it so that those shared links can time out if you want to give them only three or four days or a week to view it. And we also capture the analytics when you share it with someone. So if I were to send you a follow-up presentation, then I would then be able to see in the analytics console, understanding whether you went and viewed that content, what pages you spent time on, how much time you spent on those pages. So it makes my follow-up that much more impactful because I can target the questions Right. Yeah. You can actually see what they I love it. Awesome, Dean. Well, thanks for showing all this stuff to us. Well, so I think that it's great that you're helping people with their sales process because I know how hard it is on my side. It's stressful. There's a lot of anxiety. I bet this creates a huge amount of confidence Totally. Absolutely. I mean, if you can have more confident reps selling and representing your company and educating customers, you're going to convert more. Yeah. Well, when you're not helping people with their sales, do you No way. I have so much respect for lacrosse. My daughter plays lacrosse and I am so bad at it because I just never handled the stick as a kid. And man, do Yeah, so I've coached both men and women. I have three daughters and one son. I coach men's lacrosse primarily now though. Yeah, more equipment, more pads, little more physical for Oh, that's fantastic. I love the physicality. I got into Australian football this year. And I think I have a permanent dent in my forehead now from just running into somebody. And I am so glad to get into contact sports again. I used to play soccer. It's way more fun than soccer and triathlons because I like to think of lacrosse as a good combination between a lot of different sports. It has the scoring of basketball. It has the physicality of hockey. It has the flow of soccer or a field sport like that. So you get a lot of those different things combined into one sport Right. Well, awesome. So yeah, do you coach every No, it's a spring season, but I coach a high school team. So we have practice year round. There's always some sort of training to happen. And then my kids play as well. So I'm either being a supportive parent That's fantastic. Keep doing it. You got to invest in the next generation because they're going Wonderful. All right, Dean. Well, I think we're at the end of our time here. So thanks so much for joining me and looking forward to seeing you continue to be successful and Thanks so much for tuning into this episode of Waste to Wealth. 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